Hybrids
Good intentions, little change


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GM's 2005 Hybrid Silverado might be called "fake" because it's really a gas truck with an electric plug for powering chain saws and other tools. The engine stops when the truck stops, instead of idling, giving slight gas savings. It's started again by the beefed-up battery. On other days, it might be charitably be called a "mild hybrid", which also use tricks like "Displacement on Demand" for mild mpg savings.

"Weak" parallel hybrids are just one small step above real "fake" (sic) hybrids such as the mild hybrid.

But in 2006-7 almost every company will be offering scads of new "hybrids", trying to duplicate Toyota's success with the Prius. Many of these new offerings are as confusing as the
mild hybrid.

Here's one classification scheme for hybrids.

FAKE HYBRIDS:




Hybrid is little more than a name. Some of these have plugs that feed power from their battery to power tools, others have Combustion on Command. The electric motor is sort of a beefed-up starter motor that can assist a big engine perform a little big more efficently.

PARALLEL HYBRID (WEAK):



Parallel means the Internal Combustion ("ICE") gas engine is integrated into the power train. Weak means it cannot run on the motor alone, without the ICE, perhaps under the fiction that the ICE is needed for "real power". Motor and ICE contributions to power demand are controlled by a complicated computer.

The key example is the Honda Insight, which only has 72 "D" cell batteries. But the Insight is the most aerodynamic production car on the road, and gets the best gas mileage. Insight, like the Prius, has a vociferous fan base.
PARALLEL HYBRID (STRONG):

Larger battery or ultracap can store energy derived from regen braking. Stores far more energy than a weak parallel hybrid because
it can run on the electric motor alone as the primary traction power, although the ICE is still primary. The Toyota Prius, for example, has 1.3 kWh of battery and can run on the drive motor alone (until the computer turns on the ICE at 43 mph, or when the smog gear is cold). Toyota was first to market with this idea..



PLUG-CAPABLE HYBRID (PHEV, WEAK):

Battery is slightly larger, often about 9 kWh, and can be charged via external power ("plug-capable"). Can run on electric traction power up to a certain speed, but needs ICE for higher speeds or torque demands. Still working with the bass-ackward idea of putting the ICE first, and the electric motor second; but now, we are complicating that model by beefing up the battery and adding a charger you can plug into the wall.

Examples of this Frankenstein car is be the plug-capable Prius, that can drive up to 43 mph in stealth mode. It would be so much easier to make the Prius plug-capable if it were designed for that configuration. Prototype versions get up to
180 miles per gallon, providing a symbolic example of how to seamlessly move some of our energy use from gas to off-peak electric..

PHEV (STRONG, SERIAL)

This is in essence the "Long Ranger" by AC Propulsion, an EV with an added-on gas engine-generator that can charge the batteries or directly run the motor. Any EV can be turned into a strong PHEV just by adding on a small generator.

The electric motor is the only traction power. That's the key idea, eliminating layers of compexity. Electric is fed to the motor from a battery, which is capable of running the car for a substantial period of time. The battery is charged by an ICE motor-generator, which

only comes on when the battery is low; in general, the battery is charged from the grid, as it's "plug-capable". Big advantage, like a diesel-electric locomotive, is that the connection between the engine-generator and the battery-motor is all electric, no mechanical linkages, clutch or gearing to fool with. Backers claim this configuration can allow the average person to drive 500 miles for each gallon of gas bought.

BEV ELECTRIC CAR

RAV4-EV: Toyota's ultimately reliable EV

As the strong PHEV, but without a built-in motor-generator. On-board electric battery storage of enough electric power to travel significant distances (at least 100 miles).

In this classification scheme, a Fuel Cell Vehicle ("FCV") would be a "strong PHEV" of sorts with a fuel cell stack in place of the ICE motor-generator.

The FCV might still be at the diesel-electric configuration class, because you still have to make the H2 gas via electric power (H2 is the medium of transmission, instead of the battery); however, FCV folks would argue that FCV is, under certain conditions, completely ZEV, and that even BEV require battery recycling. And no one is proposing getting rid of all gasoline or fueled vehicles, at least for a while. Every FCV uses only the electric motor for traction power, just like an EV.

Some would say that the ultimate vehicle might be the strong PHEV (serial hybrid), because it can serve all missions and all requirements seamlessly to the driver, except for not being completely ZEV.

Others might say that the ZEV requirement is the "gold standard" and makes avoiding the serial configuration worthwhile, or at least making it only an add-on. For example, you could fit the optional engine-generator into a dock on the EV when you need to go long distances, otherwise use it as a cargo area.

  Regen Run on battery only Plug-capable Electric traction primary Serial configuration, no range issue No gasoline
FH NO          
PH (W) Y NO        
PH (S) Y Y NO      
PHEV (W) Y Y Y NO    
PHEV (S) Y Y Y Y Y  
BEV Y Y Y Y NO Y

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buy Electric cars. Hydrogen cars use 4-5 times more power than electric alone

12/22/2006 15:07

what time is it???Fanny!!!
12/19/2006 16:21

Hallo. My name is Alfred. I live in the small country of Oman on the west coast of Africa. I hate vehicles completely! I say that because when I was a small child, my left arm got stuck in the muffler of a pick-up. My dad , not knowing I was there, tried to start the car, and it blew my left arm off and disfigured my face. Death to all vehicles! Long live the horse and buggy!
10/17/2006 8:11

dont buy a hybrid car buy a hydrogen car

10/09/2006 10:44

we are now 7-0 and are 4th in state
10/09/2006 10:43

crusaders are 6-0 and will make state

10/06/2006 11:03

this is a gay place

10/06/2006 10:59

Motorcycle AC hybrids are the only realistic hybrid now and they are the only vehicle barred from AC technology. GET WITH IT HYBRID INDUSTRY. ARE YOU IDIOTS? Thanks!

09/18/2006 7:47

Talor Clark goes to Forsyth Central High School
09/17/2006 10:33

I'm Talor Clark and I bang girls
09/16/2006 11:38

hi I'm Talor Clark
My phone number is 770-887-8151
I love Girls and guys
Please call me
I'm HOT!!!!
09/16/2006 11:29

Talor Clark is SEXY!!!!!!!!!!
09/16/2006 11:22

ha ah
09/16/2006 11:19

Hybrids Plus (http: hybrids-plus.com ) offers PHEV (plug-in) conversion kits for Prius HEVs
09/12/2006 22:31

calvin strum didnt win
09/01/2006 11:41

steph is so hot

09/01/2006 11:40

I have a CNG powered van: cleaner than an Insight or Prius! Why not a methane ICE charging an EV? It would be cleaner and get better fuel economy. CNG is 128 octane and ceilinged at $2.29 per gallon equivalent. [often cheaper]. We need a national network for fuel vehicle sales Costco, maybe? LInus Hollis
07/07/2006 8:48

I don't get all this.
06/13/2006 4:12

So who is putting out the best batteries for electric cars?
06/06/2006 22:09

hi david

06/06/2006 5:33

hybrids are for faggs but w e ha kool
05/18/2006 10:56

ANYONE WANT A 20 OF PURPLE HAZE??? HOW BOUT SOME DANK? I GUESS THIS IS WHERE ALL THECOOL KIDS HANG OUT THESE DAYS, HUH?
05/17/2006 8:47

WOhsalhgfgdsfkdskhg. ok im trying to do some research on these things for school, and i couldnt help but see how everyone said I SMOKE POT! so i decided to leave a comment becausre i think you guys are silly and i admire you for saying those things. haha keep it up
05/17/2006 8:44

I will buy a hybread when they com in MERCADES (silver)
05/13/2006 14:26

i'm here
05/03/2006 6:50

what is up with this site, i don't think it give's enough information or its all fake imformation that your putting on this site. THIS SITE SHOULD BE SHUT DOWN!

04/29/2006 15:32

yo Guys that rude.....Be Nice
04/19/2006 7:45

Anyways if I was going to mae a hybrid car, first I would start with making a regular electric car that would go as far as possible like over 150miles on the highway maybe 300-400 with very good batteries or UltraCapacitors (website http: www.maxwell.com ultracapacitors products BCAP0350.html) that fully charge in less than 15 minutes. Then I would put in the car the smallest most powerful Diesel(over5KW) generator I could find to atleast double the milage similar to this one(http: www.austinev.org evalbum 122.html).

04/16/2006 19:41

runs off of not funs
04/16/2006 19:02

I just had to get that off my chest! :-D

OHHHHHH!!!!!!!!! I ALMOST FORGOT!!

There is a car that funs off of pure nonpoluted water similar to the early 1900's Stanley steamer, exept the water boils instantly when you crank the car by ELECTROMAGNETISM powered by the cars battery that gets charged by the alternator that gets powered by the engine as it's turning. So it goes in as water and exits as water. Hmm, all they need to do is find a way to put the water back into the tank... can you say perpetual-motion people!!!! ;-). http: www.pureenergysystems.com encyclopedia Energy2000 orgone.htm
04/16/2006 19:01

All hybrids of today are FAkE! My 1985 2.2L 190D gets 40MPG no K&N air filter, my relatives 1985 6600Ib GMC vandura gets 25MPG no K&N air filter(beat that you lightweight minivans!) diesel Volkswagens diesels have gotten up to 50MPG. I've heard of a 1999 1.5L non-hybrid mitsubishi getting 53MPG using regular gasoline. Here's the exact website

http: www.fueleconomy.gov mpg MPG.do?action=mpgData&vehicleID=14898&browser=true

Heres the fuel economy website of EPA and Actual MPG that people have emailed.

http: www.fueleconomy.gov feg findacar.htm
___________________________________________
Heres an interesting website
http: www.newmediaexplorer.org cgi-bin mt-comments.cgi?entry_id=74
----------------

CHECK OUT THE Original blueprints for 200 MPG carburetor invented in the 1930's found in England in the Patent office (Vaporized fuel injection system)

http: patft.uspto.gov netahtml srchnum.htm

: 1,938,497 : 1,997,497 : and 2,026,798.
-Ha beat that you stupid 60MPG hybrids.
-------------------------------------------
Heres another website of people that have dramatically increased their MPG using added on technology

http: www.wyominginstruments.com gas_home.htm
04/16/2006 18:46

hybrid batteries last the life of the vehicle. The warrenty is 8 years in most states with 10 in the clean car states like CA, NY, MA etc.
04/14/2006 22:48

everyone is gay
04/05/2006 17:48

So what the article is saying about hybrids is that some are using the name under weak pretenses that the car or truck truely is not forming to what the economy expects a hybrid to be. Is it possible to wait out this error and in the next few years the hybrid will be more benificial to the public. Some hybrid I have test drove, I felt were not as great on gas mileage as I previously heard. So Is it possible that there will be better hybrid in the marketsoon?
04/04/2006 7:58

D.King
03/29/2006 8:45

i love kris oh so much <3
03/26/2006 13:31

i love kris oh so much
03/26/2006 13:30

yo! hybrids are the best car out there right now.
03/26/2006 13:17

why is the gm hybrid consitered a fake hybrid? are there any other hybrids that are consitered fake and why
03/25/2006 20:41

buttlick
03/16/2006 7:30

i feel sexy

03/10/2006 14:19

Ross is Gay
03/09/2006 9:03

yo
03/09/2006 9:02

This site needs to be updated and cleaned up.
Edrive will offer the plugin hybrid Prius + aftermarket option later in 2006.
Hymotion is also selling kits to fleets now 3-5-2006 for plugin hybrid Prius and soon Ford Escape.
Lithium batteries are the answer. The automakers didn't understand that when they had to make cars for the mandate. You can't force progress. It has to be inovative companies that make it happen.
ACPropulsions will off the full electric SCION conversions later in 2006 with 100,200 or 300 mile range.
Jim Stack jstack6 at juno.com
03/06/2006 19:52

hi
03/01/2006 13:00

this is so fake and dumb

02/23/2006 11:19

is there already any serial PHEV commercially available ???
I want to have one, with the dimensions of a normal paasenger car with up to 5 seats as soon as possible.
02/22/2006 1:28

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02/17/2006 11:53

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02/17/2006 11:52

jibber jabbers
02/17/2006 11:49

ooga booga
02/17/2006 11:48

my mom said your gay if u smoke pot
02/15/2006 7:47

hi i like cars

02/15/2006 7:46

keep it up
02/14/2006 7:32

ok...does anyone have AIM Sn's?
02/09/2006 13:34

i'm from turkey diyecektin herhalde:) itü'de araştırmamı yapıodun:D

02/08/2006 4:23

hi
02/07/2006 10:59

yahooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Becky and Katie rock
hell yea
hybrids are okay i guess.....
01/30/2006 12:45

what is this???

01/23/2006 10:32

what is this
01/15/2006 16:51

Hey !
I'm for TURKEY!!
12/24/2005 13:55

sex on the beach
12/18/2005 13:48

you can kiss my black brut a**
12/16/2005 12:52

hi
12/15/2005 5:18

O YA IM WIT THAT GUY FRIED OUT OF MY MIND!
12/15/2005 5:16

I JUST SMOKED MY 12 JOINT IN AN HOUR WOOOOO HOOOOOO!!!
12/15/2005 5:15

spank my hairy ass, oh yeah hybrids are nice too!
12/11/2005 23:06

balls, balls, balls
12/11/2005 23:05

Dup
12/09/2005 5:36

Im smokin dubbie....................naked
12/08/2005 8:39

ZOEIE LOVES HYBRIDS

I LOVE DRUGS!!!!!!
12/08/2005 8:38

ZOEIE LOVES HYBRIDS

I LOVE DRUGS!!!!!!
12/08/2005 8:38

hello guys whats up???
hybrids rule
12/08/2005 8:38

i dont like it
12/03/2005 10:00

what are the advantages of having a hybrid cars?

12/02/2005 6:38

Is there a way to install flexible solar panels on a Prius?
11/21/2005 17:35

DEAR SIR,I HAVE DISCOVER NEW FORMULA OF RE-CYCLIC ELECTRIC CAR,THAT NEW CAR WILL GIVE YOU APROX-$5400000 EACH MONTH.CALL ME AT-00919890622274..OFFICE E-MAIL-newsuns at rediffmail.com
11/17/2005 7:05

poop

11/15/2005 16:54

i love kyle vesey & milly walker
11/10/2005 9:46

hell no
11/05/2005 17:51

Why we the customer should buy. Hybrids, how are they the best car avalible today and how they are good for the inviornment!
10/18/2005 9:16

The distance you can travel on a set of batteries depends on the speed you are traveling and the aggressiveness of your driving techniques. A Battery Electric Vehicle (BEV) or a Pluggable Hybrid Electric Vehicle (PHEV) distance traveled is directly related to the incline one is traveling on, the amount the accelerator is pushed and the speed (Mph). So far replacement costs varies because the value of batteries change as new technology arrives. Battery costs today will be different than the costs 5 to 10 years from now. To change out a gas engine in an SUV may take as much as $20,000 nowadays because labor is high and costs of engines are too.
Randy
rsun at mchsi.com
10/01/2005 23:06

this site jk it is kool
10/01/2005 16:37

i feel so fat oh my gosh
10/01/2005 16:36

when are they coming
09/28/2005 9:56

nice
09/27/2005 11:37

Hybrids are a great step, although I am really looking forward to hydrogen fuel cell technology coming through
09/26/2005 18:30

j
09/26/2005 18:29

jvjbn
09/26/2005 9:04

nobody talks on how long the battery lasts


09/14/2005 16:44

Definition of serial hybrid: the motor is the only source of traction power. The engine generator is connected to the battery-controller-motor only by wire.

A parallel hybrid has the engine melded into the power train. While the Prius is capable of performing almost as good as a serial hybrid (up to 75% of the engine's power can go into generating electric, via the second motor generator, to run the traction motor) the Prius is doomed to be a "parallel" hybrid because the engine can serve as a source of traction power. The complicated CVT planetary gears would not be needed if the Prius were a true serial hybrid.

But the Prius is much more advanced than the Honda "insect", because the insect cannot even run on its motor alone. That's why it's a "weak parallel" hybrid, while the Prius is a "strong parallel" and GM's are all pseudo, so far.
09/14/2005 9:58

Doug, I like the "hybrid comparison," however as a believer in EVs, I am so confused about the latest craze. The "new" EV owners think that they are doing the environment a favor by purchasing a petroleum burining hybrid, my comment is, duh! So, if we calculate the environmental cost of shipping these cars (all except for ford are made in Japan) on diesel burning ships (that by the way return empty) and then the costs to our freedom of relying on foreign companies to provide our mobility (and no, contrary to what some of the little pop-up ads say on the site, Toyota is not America's car company, and all they care about is profits, where are their electric vehicles?) are we further ahead? I don't think so! So we have given up what addiction, the way I see it we have two, oil (still) and relying on a foreign company that has zero loyalty to the US. One note, the Toyota is not a parallel hybrid, it is a series hybrid, and the Honda has a motorcycle size engine with an "electric Super Charger," not an EV....What we need is a viable EV battery. I believe that we are very close to having a breakthrough that could get us off our oil addiction. Keep up the good fight, I believe in EVs!
09/14/2005 9:25

So far, no Prius hybrid battery has been replaced under warranty, and there is little reason to think they will fail during the normal service life of the car. In toyota's case, more than 200,000 miles.
09/05/2005 16:57

New plugin hybrid modifications show that you can get 150 mpg or more. Only some development companies have made them so far and Toyota and Honda haven't decided to do it yet. We can only hope they will soon. UC Davis Univ has done some that get 50 miles with no gas then revert to gas-electric.
There are a few companies that have also modified the gas engine to run on hydrogen in a Hybrid. Then you get great mileage yet use clean fuel as you go. The biggest question about hydrogen is how do you make the hydrogen, from solar, wind, hydro, or nuke ,coal and other dirty non-renewable sources.
The answers are coming and WE have to help shape the outcome.
Jim jstack6 at juno.com
08/09/2005 7:56

this site doesn't tell you the price and how long the battery lasts because it ruins the whole purpose. The batteries on average last 8 to 10 years and cost around $6800 to replace. go to www.liberators.net articles LiberatorMark vehicles.hybrid.html
or go to www.motorists.com ma 110027274.htm for more information about hybrid cars.
06/03/2005 6:55

By the way Hybrid batteries last 100,000 miles or more. If you did have to replace them it was $4,000 in 2001, it's 2,500 in 2005 so by the time the warrenty runs out it maybe 1,000 or less.
Jim Stack jstack6 at juno.com
I drive a CIVIC Hybrid and get 52+ mpg over 3 years by driving smarter
05/21/2005 12:37

Hybrids are a great step. We can't all drive hydrogen vehicles until there is more hydrogen from renewable sources and fueling stations. Hybrids are here now and help.
Even hydrogen PEM vehicles use batteries to regen when stopping and increase startup times. A ICE hydrogen vehicle can use hybrid to increase range. Hybrid and electric are important helper for all vehicles.
Jim Stack jstack6 at juno.com
05/14/2005 13:19

no body talks of how long the battery will last and the cost of replacing that battery-this has to be included in the cost of ownership
03/24/2005 20:57




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